DEMOCRACY IN IRAQ الديموقراطيه في العراق

[Guest Guest]

They have one issue though. For some time they felt that the American might not be serious about democracy in Iraq. However, with Americans voted to Bush , that fear was kind of lessen.

To some of us, democracy in Iraq is so important that it was the only thing guiding our vote.

 

The people who voted for Kerry, they are thinking very simplistically because they refuse to understand the reason for the war.

 

I have heard so many of the Kerry-voters say that "dumb people voted for Bush because they don't care about the war."

 

This is funny, isn't it? But very sad. How do you reason with such people.

[Guest mustefser]

http://www.alrafidayn.com/Story/News/N_06_11_04_1.html

 

In Arabic.. A very important development.. The six member high Shia commitee, reached agreement among all Shia factions and parties to entre the ellection in one National list.

Their will be 50% non party members, the other 50% will be devided as follows

10% for Alsader party

12% for SRCI, including the Modersee partee

10% for Aldawa "Inside"

10% for Aldawa "Aljaafree"

8% for the Shia house "Alchalabee, Bahraloum and others"

 

There some reports that Chrestian "Cldan. Ashuree, Armen..etc" and Turkman and Yazedees will participate in this list.. Also there is a very strong support for it from the very strong Sunni Arab tribal leader Shiekh Fawaz Alshemeree in Mousol.That is after his visit to Alsystani last week.

Also there are rumers that The strong Sunni Clergy association might joine the national list!

 

الشيعة يطرحون (القائمة الوطنية) للانتخابات حسب النسب المئوية وكبرى العشائر السنية وهيئة علماء المسلمين تقرر الدخول والمنافسة من خلالها

بغداد-كمال محمد-النجف-حسين الحسني-الرافدين-6-11 : قالت مصادر مقربة من المرجع الشيعي الاعلى اية الله علي السيستاني للرافدين ان اللجنة السداسية التي شكلت من قبل المرجعية الدينية في النجف والتي تشرف مباشرة على اختيار القوائم المرشحة للانتخابات ان اللجنة حددت النسب المئوية للاحزاب والتيارات السياسية العراقية التي ستدخل في (القائمة الوطنية) والتي ستنافس في الانتخابات المقرر عقدها في بداية عام 2005.

وحددت اللجنة السداسية القائمة حسب قوة تاثير التيارات السياسية في الساحة العراقية.

وقالت المصادر ان تحديد هذه النسب جاء بالتوافق وتحت اشراف المرجع الشيعي الاعلى والذي حدد فيه خمسون بالمئة للاحزاب والتيارات السياسية الفاعلة في العراق وخمسون بالمئة للمستقلين

واشارت المصادر الى ان النسب جاءت على حسب التصنيف التالي:

12% للمجلس الاعلى للثورة الاسلامية ( عبد العزيز الحكيم) على شرط ان تدخل ( منظمة العمل الاسلامي) برئاسة المدرسي من ضمن النسبة.

10% التيار الصدري ( مقتدى الصدر )

10% حزب الدعوة الاسلامي ( ابراهيم الجعفري )

8% الدعوة تنظيم العراق ( العنزي + عز الدين سليم )

10 % المجلس السياسي الشيعي ( احمد الجلبي, المحمداوي,محمد بحر العلوم واخرين )

50% لقوائم المستقلين يرشح بعضهم الاحزاب المذكورة.

واوضحت المصادر الى ان اعضاء اللجنة السداسية لايحق لهم الدخول في القائمة الوطنية.

والمحت المصادر الى ان عشائر كبيرة ولها الثقل من الطائفة السنية قررت الدخول بالقائمة الوطنية فيما اوضحت مصادر قريبة من هيئة علماء المسلمين  الى ان هناك مشاورات تجري الى احتمال دخول جميع التنظيمات السنية في القائمة الوطنية.

وقالت جهات كردية الى ان الاكراد لم يحسموا الامر مشيرة الى ان حركة الوفاق الوطني برئاسة رئيس الحكومة المؤقته اياد علاوي والديمقراطيين برئاسة عدنان الباججي قررت الدخول في تحالف مع الاكراد والمنافسة في الانتخابات بقائمة موحدة.

احزاب شيعية وضمن المشاورات الجارية هددت بالانسحاب من القائمة الوطنية في حال اذا سمح لتيار رئيس الوزراء الحالي ( حركة الوفاق الوطني ) بالدخول والتنافس ضمن القائمة الوطنية

وفي تطور للمشهد على الساحة السنية العراقية قرر شيخ مشايخ عشيرة شمر الكبرى ( فواز الشمري ) والذي يتخذ من مدينة الموصل  مقرا لعشيرته وبعد زيارة ناجحة للمرجع الشيعي علي السيستاني الى الدخول وبثقل عشيرته في القائمة الوطنية.

وسيدخل ضمن القائمة الوطني كل من المسيح والتركمان واليزيدين.

[Guest Mustefser]

Yesterday in an interview with CNN world service, Palistanian Mr. bari Atwan was talking about situation in Palistine after Yser Arafat.. He was strongly recommending an ellection to chose succesur for Arafat.. He said any appointed leader will be not good for future of middel east.

 

On other interviews with Aljezera and on his London newspaper Alqudus, He is opposing ellection in Iraq, based on the issue of Iraq being under occpation.

 

The interviewer did ask him why the case is different in Palistine..

May be he doesn't consider Iraeli presence in Plalestine as occupation though!!!

Any one know

 

بالامس وفي مقابله لسي ان ان "الانكليزي" مع السيد عبد الباري عطوان , دعا وبشده الى ضروره اجراء انتخابات لاختيار خليفه للسيد عرفات.

موضحا ان اسلوب تعيين الخليفه الجديد سيكون مضرا بمستقبل العمليه السياسيه.

 

عبد الباري ومن على الجزيره و صحيفته اللندنيه " القدس" كان قد وقف بشده امام اجراء انتخابات في العراق بحجه ان العراق تحت الاحتلال.

لم يساله المقدم عن سبب اختلاف الامر في الحاله الفلسطينيه..

ربما ,السيد عطوان لا يعتبر الوجود الاسرائيلي احتلالا, ربما

هل هناك من بعرف الجواب؟

[baghda]

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/11/07/internat...lection.html?th

 

About Ellection and parties preparations

[Guest Guest_tajer]

http://www.nahrain.com/d/news/04/11/07/nhr1107a.html

In Arabic.. The rules for Govenators ellection s

[Guest Mustefser]

http://www.aljeeran.net/viewarticle.php?id...pg=index&art=mp

 

In Arabic.. Translation of newyork times article above..

[improvius]

To some of us, democracy in Iraq is so important that it was the only thing guiding our vote.

 

The people who voted for Kerry, they are thinking very simplistically because they refuse to understand the reason for the war.

 

I have heard so many of the Kerry-voters say that "dumb people voted for Bush because they don't care about the war."

 

This is funny, isn't it? But very sad. How do you reason with such people.

One problem is that Bush has never been honest with us (Americans) about the reason for the war. You can't expect us to understand when we are never told the truth.

 

-Imp

[Guest Mustefser]

Imp,

If you go back to what Bush had said about war justification, you might find

- Get rid of Dectatorship of Saddam

-Bringing democracy to Iraq, as a step to move to the whole middel east

-WDM

 

Those who accuse Pres. Bush of lying were relying on the third point after no WDM had been found. They never arguing the other two because they thing that these two should never be a real causes for a realistic American forgin policy.

Here is the catch,

-For the WDM, it was not only Bush who thought of Saddam having it. Democrats imposed sanctions that had killed one million Iraqis over ten years on that bases which turned to be faulse. Did any libral scholar put that as a point against democrats? Is it because one milion life of Iraqi civilians not important as lifes of one thousan American soldier? The answer is not. Every one, even Saddam himself, were believing that he had WDMs. All evidences showed that .

 

-For the democracy point.. Librals and radicals, were accuasing Bush of having it as excuse. Then when it turned to be real , as is the case now in Iraq, they just ignore it as a possible objectives of the war. They even start to compaining against it, having so many excuses..

 

Can you please let know where didn't Bush tell the truth ?

[Guest Mustefser]

http://www.sotaliraq.com/newiraq/article_2004_11_8_2732.html

In Arabic.. By an expatriot Iraqi scholar , Sabah Dara, replying on a call by the Iraqi Lawers commitee secretary. The Secretary Mr. Aallo"an former Saddamee" had denouced in Alzaman factionist londen newspaper ,the decision by the elelction commitee to allow expatriot Iraqis to participate in the eelection.. He accuased the four millions expatriots as being "suspected" figures. Mr. Allao wanted ellection to be a grant for only those who had the goverment sanction card.

During Sanctions, UN had reached to agreement with Saddam to distribut the oil-against-food revenue as bonuse through a government card. All those who opposed the regime and those outside Iraq were blocked from getting that card!!

[improvius]

Can you please let know where didn't Bush tell the truth ?

Many of us believe that we should not go to war unless there is a serious threat to our own country. Bush tried to convince us of that, when in reality it seems like Iraq was not much of a threat at all. I know his real goal was to transform Iraq into a democratic ally. But he never presented it as such.

 

-Imp

[Guest Mustefser]

Fully understanig your point.. However, do you think that he really thought that Saddam mightn't have WDM..?

I don't think any one did, including Mr. Kerry who agreed on the war as a way to force saddam to get rid of them.

 

He might be mislead , as all other were. But not misleading.

You might say that he was using it as excuse for the other objective.. My question is what is wrong with it? Are you against bringing democracy to middel east.. ? 100% of those who hit us in 9/11 were comming from ME. Isn't the fixing of that region dynamics a critical part of the total solution? So why not hitting one bird with two stones in one shot!!!

[Guest Bostonian]

To some of us, democracy in Iraq is so important that it was the only thing guiding our vote.

 

The people who voted for Kerry, they are thinking very simplistically because they refuse to understand the reason for the war.

 

I have heard so many of the Kerry-voters say that "dumb people voted for Bush because they don't care about the war."

 

This is funny, isn't it? But very sad. How do you reason with such people.

One problem is that Bush has never been honest with us (Americans) about the reason for the war. You can't expect us to understand when we are never told the truth.

 

-Imp

Bush has always been honest about the reasons for the war. He never presented Iraq, per se, as a threat to the US. He presented Saddam Hussein as a threat to us, and not as a direct threat, but rather because SH was a source of instability and anti-American sentiment, not to mention connections to many terrorist groups, ACKNOWLEDGED BY BOTH PARTIES IN CONGRESS.

 

Moreover, SH was the unfinished business. How do you convince the world that you can & will defeat the terrorists, if you leave SH untouched? The US came to the aid of its ally Kuwait in 1991, and honored its obligation to that country, but then left SH in power, so that he could still claim he won that war. With him still in power, who could believe that the US had the will to destroy Al Qaeda?

 

The fever swamp of the left-Democrats has refused to believe that Bush meant EXACTLY what he said. That fever swamp has fallen prey to increasingly bizarre conspiracy theories, which is why the Democrats lost BIG TIME. The Democrats will not return to office until they throw out the conspiracy theories and embrace reality. 58 million Americans say so.

[Guest Bostonian]

Improv,

 

Bush & his administration told the American people many times that it was good, desirable, and morally correct to transform Iraq into a representative government. If you did not hear this, it is because you had your fingers in your ears.

 

***

For my part, I think that if Iraq becomes a close ally, that is good for us, but not necessary. I want only for Iraq to be a safe & good place for its people. It is true that democracies do not go to war with each other and also democracies do not tolerate terrorists.

[Guest mustefser]

http://www.alrafidayn.com/Story/News/N_08_11_04_10.html

 

In arabic.. An interview with Muder Shawket the Sunni Arab debuty of Alchalabee.

He thought that Some important figures of Arab Sunni might join what is called now as "Asystani list" He thought that Alawee might loose position in the next ellection.

[Guest Mustefser]

Very intersting post by Zyad

 

http://healingiraq.blogspot.com/

 

Onset of Elections Fever in Iraq

I mentioned before in a previous post that a significant section of Iraqis seemed uninterested in the forthcoming national elections for various reasons, but that the general feeling in Kurdistan and southern Iraq was a bit different. My statement still holds true except that the last part of it is a gross understatement; Iraqis here in the south are ardently making preparations on all levels for the event, almost with religious zeal.

 

Posters with detailed instructions on voters registration are on every street corner and lamp post in Basrah, badly printed handbills and leaflets calling for people to vote are widely circulated, photocopied statements and fatwas from the Marji'iya and Hawza clerics in support for elections are hanging in stores, hospitals, governmental departments, and coffee shops. City councils, municipalities, civil society organisations, mosques and husseiniyas are all arranging and holding meetings to prepare for the voting procedures.

 

People in Baghdad and the surrounding areas may say that elections are irrelevant or that the outcome has already been decided by Zionists/infidels/neocons/imperialists/capitalists/Jews and that puppets/agents/lackeys/mercenaries/traitors will rule the country, but for the people around me here in Basrah, this is a historical moment they have all been waiting for. I admit that I may not share their enthusiasm but it is surely an encouraging scene to witness.

 

While many people in Baghdad still have no idea about the voting process or what/who they are supposed to be voting for, our janitor here at the doctors residence meticulously described the whole procedure to me. Many in Baghdad, for example, still erroneously believe that voting will be for presidential candidates, whereas people here are aware that they would be voting to elect a 275 member National Assembly and governorate councils, and that Iraqi Kurds, in addition, vote to elect Kurdish parliament members.

 

I observed that many posters on the streets in support for elections contained some inappropriate and insinuating slogans, such as "A small minority is trying to deny the right of the majority to choose its destiny. Vote and show the intruders who the true Iraqis are," and "Ba'athist remnants and people of the evil triangle oppose the elctions because it will demonstrate to all their true numbers."

 

A recent statement from Sistani advised local councils and clerics to help educate and assist people in distant villages to register for the voting. The statement also called for "people with disabilities, and even the elderly on their death beds" to vote because "every person counts and can influence the elections."

 

The Hawza also welcomed the decision to include Iraqis in exile in the elections. Some heated debates have been going on in Iraqi official circles on whether to include them or not. The Independent Electoral Commission claimed that there were a few technical difficulties. The National Council agreed on a further 90 billion dollars to the budget allocated for elections to ensure participation of Iraqi expatriates.

 

At least 4 million Iraqis live in exile with the majority living in the UK, Sweden, USA, Germany, Jordan, UAE, Iran and New Zealand. Australia, Canada, the Netherlands, Norway, Syria, Libya and Yemen also have sizable Iraqi communities. Their votes have a significant importance since many of them are highly educated and have experienced western democracies firsthand.